Gaming Your Wife Tips

Some more nuggets mined from Dalrock’s post What Do HUSies Want (Not linked because I don’t want to pollute Dalrock’s blog with trackbacks. If you want to follow the entire conversation pick up the link from When A Woman LJBF’s You)

Start running some game. What kind of game tactics will depend much on what you feel needs to be addressed or modified about your relationship. The best kind of game to start with is simply to start eliminating beta behaviors.

  • Say “I love you” a little less.
  • Don’t say things like “I can’t live without you” or “Do you love me?”
  • Eliminate supplication.
  • Ask less, tell more.
  • Suggest less, direct more.
  • Do not ask for permission for things like buying a new pair of shoes or something else you might need. Just tell her you are going to do it, and then do it.

David Collard added a few of his own tips into conversation:

– Interrupt her (sometimes)
– Ignore her (sometimes).
– If she becomes emotional, stay calm.
– If she becomes emotional, laugh at her.
– Call her “sexist” names.
– Objectify her.
– Make chauvinistic remarks.
– Pretty much do the exact opposite of what marriage advice articles suggest.
– Don’t buy her flowers, unless you really feel like it.
– If she asks what you are getting her for Valentine’s Day, say something like, “Nothing, but I am looking forward to you doing a pole dance for me”.
– Patronise her.
– Talk down to her.

The basic idea is to put her, not you, in a supplicatory position. She should feel that she is working for your approval. If you feel you are trying to please her all the time, you are doing it wrong.

A lot of the above comes fairly naturally to me. But I know it sounds strange. The thing is that no woman will tell you this. They don’t consciously know it. They think they want to be treated like a queen. They don’t really, not deep down where it counts.

Deti continues with:

David Collard has excellent suggestions to get you started. They are designed to show her that her shit tests aren’t going to throw you off. Your frame is one of “so you’re being a bitch. You can be a bitch alone. I won’t put up with it.” If she’s being bitchy, give her some pushback. Tell her you won’t put up with it. After you interrupt her, ignore her, and laugh at her stupid emotional outbursts, start really objectifying her. Grope her sometimes. Pinch her ass. Tell her to bend over again so you can really get a good look.

After this starts working and you start seeing results, then making it clear that what you want will now start becoming a priority, and that starts with sex. Don’t ever ask for sex. Tell her you are going to have sex, and she is going to give it to you. After that works, start telling her what to do for you and to you. Take charge of your sex life. Direct your sex life to what you want it to be.

In all this, remember that you can’t be afraid to offend her or make her mad. Roissy Commandment #16 is “Never be afraid to lose her”. Sure she’ll get mad sometimes. Sure she might withhold sex (for a few days). My new frame on this is: “Well, if you withhold sex, I’ll withhold commitment. And if withholding sex goes on long enough it’s marital abandonment and mental cruelty, both of which I consider grounds for divorce.”

I don’t know that withholding sex constitutes abandonment in the biblical sense. I do know that traditionally one of the husband’s benefits of marriage is regular sex at reasonable intervals, i.e. sex on command. If a man cannot even get regular sex from a wife because she willfully refuses to provide it, then why on earth should he marry or remain married to her?

A husband does not need to “earn” sex from a wife. By virtue of his position as her husband, in my view regular sexual contact with his wife is his right, and her concomitant obligation. If she had not wanted or agreed to that obligation, then she should not have taken it on by marrying.

If she is willfully refusing to meet her obligations, then he is justified in refusing to carry out his obligations of continued investment and commitment. She has abandoned her obligation to provide regular sex, and therefore has abandoned her husband, and has abandoned her marriage. That abandonment is sufficient, in my view, for the husband to withdraw his investment and commitment, and thus is cause for divorce.

Posted in Game | Tagged , | 6 Comments

Manning Up the Right Way

This came from a second discussion arising from the same University of Man post about a female FB conversation. Dessox is a 26 year old guy that wants to get married but is disgusted with the current state of women. He asked the above question.

Deti’s answer:

If you don’t mind an old married man chiming in:

Dessox, the problem you are describing is that men have softened up and largely become feminized versions of themselves because they are scared to death of offending their woman. They live under a constant implicit threat that their woman will turn off the sex spigot and leave them for another man.

Women are innately able to sense weakness in a man, and can sniff out manginas and white knights from a mile away. Women have also become more masculinized. Don’t believe me? Go sit at your local mall. Know what you’ll see?

Women leading around their husbands or BFs. Sloppily dressed, fat, deliberately unattractive women in sweatpants and flipflops. Women with beerguts (I. Kid. You. Not. Gross as hell, man.) Women who are 30, 50, 60 pounds and up overweight, scarfing down KFC like there’s no tomorrow. Women berating their husbands and kids — in public, while said husbands and kids cower in corners.

Men who follow their wives or GFs around like lost puppies, asking for permission to do anything and everything. Men who can’t even make a decision on when to eat lunch. Men who stand there and tolerate the absolute nastiest disrespect in public from their women.

The way to fix this is for men to be men, and stop putting up with women’s shit. Just stop. Tell your girl you’re sick of it, and you won’t tolerate it anymore. Whatever it is. If she walks, let her walk.

[Girl’s name], this is BS. You treat me like shit and disrespect me in public. I’m not putting up with one more ounce of it. I’m done. Things are going to change in this[relationship][marriage], and I mean right now. I don’t intend to stay one more second in this relationship putting up with your crappy behavior. If that means it’s over, then it’s over.

And one of three things will happen within 24 hours.

  1. The bitchiness dissipates, like fog on a sunny morning.
  2. She leaves, because being a bitch is more important to her than you are.
  3. You leave, because your integrity and peace is more important than staying with a bitch.

I really believe turning the tide on this just requires a man to say “No more”.

And if we’re going to do this, we have to be prepared to walk away from a relationship or a marriage where we’re not getting what we want and need. We have to be ready to cut her loose. We have to be ready for her pouting and turning off sex for a (very short) time. We have to be prepared to simply end things if they don’t turn around.

Here’s another few things that are turning this around, Dessox:

  1. You want to sex up sluts? I don’t personally agree with it, but if that’s your thing, have at it till the moon turns green. But don’t invest in them, don’t commit to them, don’t spend fortunes on them, and don’t marry them.
  2. Don’t give any woman any more respect than she gives herself.
  3. Don’t invest or commit until you’re satisfied she really likes you. A “first date” is not dinner at a fancy restaurant with appetizer and wine. Don’t go all in on a woman.
  4. Gauge her interest from the outset.
    a. Escalate physically. Push hard for physical intimacy. Go as far as she will let you.
    b. Sharply limit the investment you make. Limit the amount of time, money and resources you spend. End dates first. Hang out at your place or hers with a video. Do this until she proves herself interested in you AND worthy of your investment.

If you are being continually rebuffed, or she insists on expensive dinners or entertainment — bail out. She’s just not that into you, or she’s a status whore or entitlement princess looking to use you.

Posted in Manosphere | Tagged , , | 2 Comments

What Today’s Women Think Of Men

From a University of Man post about a female FB conversation where the wimmenz hamsters went into overdrive about a prior UMan post.

Many thanks to Mentu for this. It isn’t often you get to see hamsters in the wild, and in their natural habitat (Facebook). There we can see the hamster’s machinations, unhindered by the Heisenberg principle.

Young single men reading here, go back up and read the Hamster droppings carefully. This is what today’s women think of you:

  1. You’re barely good enough to take care of me and do the dishes. You’re certainly not good enough to have sex with.
  2. We don’t want to have sex with you. We want the alpha dominant men, men who tingle us.
  3. We don’t need you. We can get married any time we want. So you will just have to wait until we’re ready.
  4. Marriage and relationships ain’t all they’re cracked up to be.
  5. Men need to take more equal roles in relationships. They need to be more involved in child care and household chores so we women can have “quality time” (read: so we can sneak off to bang our personal trainers and old alpha college BFs on the side).

So there you go. This is what women like this think of you. By and large they don’t appreciate you. They don’t want sex with any but the most alpha dominant men. They will use you for whatever they can get out of you. They expect “egalitarian” relationships (read: female dominated relationships). They are selfish, self-absorbed and entitled. Marriage has no importance to them beyond what they expect to receive from it. Marriage — and marriageable men — will always be there when they want it, so they feel no need to rush.

Another thought:

With women like this, why is anyone surprised that men are reacting and responding with:

  1. sharply limiting investment and commitment
  2. pushing hard for early sex
  3. limiting time and money outlays for women until after sex, and even then keeping money and time investment at a minimum
  4. driving stakes through the heart of conventional “dating”
  5. douche-bag behavior
  6. preemptive vasectomy
  7. pump & dump
  8. absolute refusal to marry, much less father children
Posted in Manosphere | Tagged | 1 Comment

The Merits of Game

This series of comments originated on The Private Man’s Contact page when another commenter called SEAL debated the value of game. I added formatting to the comment make it more presentable.

SEAL, leaving aside the obvious attempt at shaming language you heap on PrivateMan, you suggest a couple of things:

  1. that Game is merely a tool to bed women; and
  2. that Game’s practitioners live a lie and don’t really know who they are, and are thus incapable of true relationships.

I think you’re wrong on both counts.

(1): At its core, Game is not, as your posts suggest, a form of manipulation to get women into bed. There are some who form elaborate lines, routines and choreography to do that, but that is only one part of what Game is. In my estimation, Game is a mindset, a frame if you will, that responds to and explodes the myths and lies that we men have been taught for two generations.

Chief among these lies is that if we are Nice Guys™ and we just act as ourselves, women will flock to us. Our parents, our teachers, our civic and religious authorities, our society, lied to us that we needed to be unfailingly nice and pleasant to all women, that we had to suck up to them and put up with their unreasonable demands, and give them whatever they asked for. We were told that if only we did these things, we would find That One Special Woman™ and she would love us forever. We were also told that if it did not work out with That One Special Woman™, no one else would ever love us, and we would be relegated to a life of loneliness and involuntary celibacy.

These are nothing but pretty lies.

We tried these things. We tried wooing girls with the “nice guy” treatment. They did not work. What worked was our inner game, i.e. becoming the best men we could be through our work, improving our physical bodies, and exercising our minds, to project outer confidence and dominance in the spheres we live and work in.

We learned about the true nature of women. Most men are not even remotely attractive to most women. But nearly all women are at least somewhat attractive to most men. Women are not naturally monogamous, but are hypergamous (i.e. they seek the best men they can get for sex and relationships). If a man tingles a woman, she’ll be attracted to him. But if he no longer tingles her, she’ll seek another man who does. Women initiate 70% of divorces. The laws are heavily rigged in favor of women to protect their hypergamous choices. Women rarely say what they really mean.

Women are able to formulate a rationalization for everything they do, even if it fails every moral, social, relationship, religious, or societal standard. And they can cause that rationalization to make absolute, perfect sense to themselves, even in the face of boatloads of conflicting factual evidence. Women deploy emotions and feelings where men employ logic and reason. Women are the gatekeepers of sex; men are the gatekeepers of investment and commitment. Women are drawn to male displays of confidence, social dominance, power and charisma. Men are drawn to women with the attributes of youth, physical appeal, chastity and fertility.

These are the ugly truths we have faced and accepted.

(2) On the contrary, those who don’t practice inner and outer game are those who don’t truly know who they are. They have no idea what they can do once armed with the truth. Living the pretty lies places an unnatural veneer over a man, and prevents him from showing his true self.

  • It is only when he understands his own nature and that of women, that he can truly know himself.
  • It is only when he can cast off a relationship that no longer works for him, and then stand on his own alone, that he can know what he can do (and do without).
  • It is only when he can say he doesn’t need the woman, that he can know himself. And then, knowing himself, he can offer his true self to a woman on his terms alone, and she can accept or reject as she sees fit.

I can say I’ve learned more about myself, and what I can do, in the last three months than I’ve learned in the past 25 years as a man.

SEAL, nobody is pulling a fast one here. No one’s defrauding anyone else (or, at least, men are not the ones doing the defrauding). Men get in this game to get sex. Women get in this game to secure a man’s resources and commitment. This is how it has always been. It is just that the rules have changed in the last 30 or so years. It used to be that the exchange was above board and clean — sex for commitment/money, and vice versa, FOR LIFE.

In the past 30 years, the woman secures the man’s resources and commitment — but only for as long as she wants them or decides she needs them. And the current laws in the United States reflect this. The new rules say she can leave anytime she wants, for any reason she wants. Usually, she wants out because

  • her husband/LTR boyfriend is not sufficiently alpha.
  • He doesn’t make enough money.
  • He’s gotten older, fatter and balder.
  • He lets her make the rules.
  • He cowers and rushes to her aid every time she is upset, angry or agitated.
  • He gives in on every fight or disagreement.
  • He’s been down on his luck or unemployed for a while.
  • He’s stressed out because he hates his job and he’s tired all the time.
  • He does whatever she wants, whenever she wants.
  • He’s at her beck and call all the time.

So she breaks up or initiates divorce proceedings, taking half of his stuff and income, and ruining the children’s lives and her own in the process. She continues taking his stuff and income, while ending his sexual relationship with her.

Men started getting wise to this. They noticed their wives saying things like “I’m unhappy” or “I don’t find you physically attractive” or “I love you, but I’m not in love with you”. And they started figuring out why — it was because they weren’t accepting their dominant roles in their relationships with their wives. Single men noticed they could not get second dates. Men noticed that showering girls with attention and niceness only drove the girls away or creeped them out. They noticed that the ROI was pretty low on buying girls drinks, meals and gifts. They started figuring out that women were asking questions to which they did not want direct answers or challenging them to test their mettle as men (also known as fitness testing). And these single men started figuring out that they had been lied to — that everything their parents, society and authorities had told them was simply not true.

Women do not want nice guys. Wives do not want supplicating, groveling betas. They want men who can stand on their own two feet. They want men who set the course of their relationships and marriages. They want men who will tell them no when necessary. They want men who will not put up with their shit. They want men who know what they want and pursue it. Wives want some beta in their husbands, but they want more alpha — more independence, more dominance, more leadership, more assertiveness.

That’s why Game is much more than a tool to get women in bed. That’s why Game helps men know who they truly are.

And another thing, SEAL:

You accuse PrivateMan of narcissism. I think that’s incorrect. A healthy regard for oneself is not narcissism. Recognizing one’s own strengths and successes is not narcissism, particularly when those successes are put out for public consumption in a public forum for others to study and perhaps to replicate. Acknowledging improvements where there had been shortcomings before is not narcissism.

Betas are taught to be subservient, subordinate and supplicating. They are taught and conditioned to subordinate their own desires and sacrifice themselves, sometimes for undeserving, ungrateful women. Unlearning those behaviors is a difficult thing. Learning to love yourself after a lifetime of being taught you should hate yourself and your desires is a difficult thing. Learning to put your own desires first and not prioritize others above yourself when they haven’t earned it is a difficult thing.

So I think a little self-love and self-regard is not uncalled for.

Source: The Private Man Contact Page originally posted June 29, 2011

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When A Woman LJBF’s You

This series of comments originated on Dalrock’s post What Do HUSies Want. [The original post and the discussion that followed is worthwhile reading.] In the discussion a poster named Pb posted the following question:

A solicitation for advice on escaping the beta mindset: you can probably fill in the blanks, but as someone who has been probably LJBFed but was content to be a friend but is finally tired of being treated poorly as a friend/ignored, should I just cut off contact without saying anything or is that urge to say something a right one to follow? How should I channel the anger/hurt?

Deti responded with:

Not to pile on too much, but the advice you’ve received from bskillet and observer is sound. What I’m going to say will sound harsh, so I apologize in advance.

She LJBF’d you after you showed interest. You befriended her anyway. She was seeing someone else and is now overseas. You don’t like LJBF, you resent it, and you’re vacillating between making another try at her affections or just being friends or walking away. Walking away and cutting off all contact with her is the best option.  Never, never be friends with any woman who LJBFs you explicitly or implicitly.

What are you getting out of this “friendship”? She gets affirmation and validation in the form of attention from a man whom she knows wants a romantic relationship with her. You get nothing. She is using you and wasting (at the very least) your time.

Do absolutely nothing for a woman who LJBFs you. Do not spend time with her unless you and she happen to be in the same place with mutual friends. Do not give her any one on one time. Do not be her friend. Do not indulge her by listening to her stories of her a**hole boyfriends, her pump & dump misadventures, or how “I just want a nice guy who will treat me right.” Don’t return her phone calls or texts. Under no circumstances should you ever spend any money on her or give her any help with anything.

Women are the gatekeepers of sex. But YOU are the gatekeeper of your investment and commitment. The things you have of value are your time, money, expertise and resources. These things are valuable, and they should not be expended on anyone who is (1) unworthy; or (2) unwilling to reciprocate.

This woman wants you to invest in her for free — she wants you to give her your time, money and resources, but she wants, nay, expects, to give you nothing back in return. Her view on it is that all she has to do is grace you with her very presence, to dollop out small amounts of her attention on you, and you should simply want to reciprocate with your time. No. That is a waste of your time, and you should put an end to it now.

Yohami created a post of the above advice titled Deti Wisdom and added his take on it.

Posted in Uncategorized | Tagged , , | 5 Comments

Christian Men and Cheating Wives

Women who cheat on their husbands, having hot monkey sex with a badboy thug while playing the role of the faithful wife, are even worse than those who cheat and then seek divorce. Those women are not only cheaters, but also liars, deceivers, connivers and manipulators. I also don’t think they can keep it up if they have husbands who are paying attention. Is it any wonder that men worry about their wives cheating?

Certainly, not all women are like that. There are enough women who are exactly like that. And that’s a big part of the problem, IMO.

Agree with your statement about Christian men being expected to “warm it” at home. All this has really made me rethink the “Fireproof”/Promise Keepers movement. Even among Christian communities, men are expected to do all the work, bring all the assets, make her feel loved/safe/protected/provisioned. She need only bring….. her awesomely awesome self. The woman’s “virtue” and devotion to the marriage are presumed. If there is something wrong in the marriage, it is presumed to be the husband’s fault. The church attitude of “love your wife as Christ loved the Church and gave Himself up for her” is translated by many women — and even pastors — as “the man/husband has to do everything for me, give me everything I want/need/desire, and cater to my every whim.”

What is conveniently omitted is the exhortation for wives to respect their husbands — which, IIRC, St. Paul states FIRST, BEFORE the instruction to men to love their wives.

On Dalrock – Is Frivolous Divorce Overstated


Follow up comment: December 30, 2011

Jennifer says:

“Pregnancy is a more harmful implication, but the problem I had is that I’m basically tired of seeing men, with usually loose morals, claim that male adultery is not as bad; ”

Christian morality draws no distinction between a man cheating on his wife, on one hand, and a woman cheating on her husband. In God’s eyes according to Scripture, both are equally reprehensible. But from a purely evo-bio standpoint, there are differences, and male adultery is not as threatening to a marriage as a wife’s adultery. Leave aside moral considerations and let me explain.

A man bears more risks, and more severe financial and other risks, from his wife cheating than she does if he cheats. The primary risk he bears is the potential for cuckoldry: being forced to support a child that is not his, with the full knowledge of the wife and her keeping that knowledge from him. This is simply because of the nature of female sexuality — she can have sex with men in succession and conceal the true identity of the father, and in fact not really know who the father is. She can also hide a clandestine affair from her husband, she knows the alpha interloper is the sire; but defrauds her husband into believing he is the father.

See the story of David and Bathsheba, in which David tells Bathsheba’s husband Uriah to go home for a time (i.e. “go have sex with your wife”) on his return from the battlefrontier. Why did David do this? Obviously, to help conceal his sin. If David had knocked up Bathsheba, he wanted Uriah to sex her up so everyone, including Uriah himself, would believe Uriah was the daddy. That’s I Samuel or II Samuel, I think.

The only way a husband can be sure the child is his is through DNA paternity testing. If the husband cheats and impregnates another woman, there is no chance the wife will be defrauded into supporting the other woman’s child. By contrast, there is a very real risk the wife can defraud her husband into supporting a child that is not his. This is a risk the wife simply does not run, and will never have to run.

There are differences in why husbands and wives cheat. If a husband cheats, it is usually for sexual variety. He has no intention of divorcing his wife. He simply wants some sex on the side, a fling, or a ONS. He is committed to his wife and has no intention of offering any kind of commitment, emotional or otherwise, to the fling or the ONS. (I know, I know, Jennifer, you’re gnashing your teeth and saying BAD BAD BAD JERK AMORAL ASSHOLE CAD PUA WAAAAHHHH WAHHHH WAAAAAH. I told you to leave the morality aside. Let me finish.)

It’s different when a woman cheats. When she cheats, she’s checked out of the marriage, She is 100% done with her husband. By the time she decides to offer her body to another man, she has nothing left for her husband. She no longer loves him (assuming she ever did love him or care about him in the first place), she feels absolutely nothing for him but contempt, hatred and derision. Before this she’s run the gamut of emotion with her husband: anger, asking him to “change” or “be more attractive”, then demanding that he “change”, threats, emotional distancing, girls nights out, marriage counseling, even trial separation. (Note that SHE demands that HE do things to make the marriage better. In her eyes if the marriage is having problems it is ALWAYS HIS FAULT. She is never held to account for her part in any marital problems.)

When she cheats, she is preparing herself and her body for a new husband and a new lover. When she cheats, she has moved on and is looking to fulfill the female imperative of serial monogamy — she’s done with this one and now wants the next one.

This is why wife cheating is worse than male cheating. When a wife cheats, it almost always means the end of the marriage. This is why when a man cheats, the wife wants to know “Do you love her?” Because the wife knows if he loves the other woman, he will invest in her (not the wife). He will want to give the other woman his time, his resources and his money. Almost all the time, he has not had sex with another woman because he loves the other woman. Rather, he had recreational sex with the other woman and is still in love with and committed to his wife.

But when she cheats, the husband wants to know “did you have sex with him?” Because if she had sex with him, she has severed her bond to her husband and bonded or sought to bond with the new man. Severance of that bond means she does not want the husband, does not love him and does not care about him or his feelings. Once she has severed that bond, it cannot be reconnected absent the most extreme effort, and he knows it is over. If she had sex with the new man, he knows that he no longer has any claim on her heart. And when you get right down to it, if she has had sex with another man, he knows that she has rejected him as not alpha enough and not a sufficiently suitable candidate to impregnate her with his seed.

That’s why wife cheating is far more threatening than male cheating is.


I don’t agree that husbands should be allowed to cheat on their wives. The sole purpose of my comment was to explain how and why wife cheating is more threatening to a marriage than husband cheating from an evolutionary biology standpoint. It should not be construed as a justification for husband cheating.

Husband cheating has its own problems: possible diversion of some husband time and resources, spread of venereal disease, possibility that he will impregnate the mistress.

Posted in Infidelity | Tagged | 11 Comments